{"id":3675,"date":"2020-11-30T05:48:00","date_gmt":"2020-11-30T05:48:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.ramolawpc.com\/?p=3675"},"modified":"2020-12-15T02:02:51","modified_gmt":"2020-12-15T02:02:51","slug":"hollywood-reporter-11-30-2020","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.ramolawpc.com\/new\/hollywood-reporter-11-30-2020\/","title":{"rendered":"Aaron Eckhart on ‘Wander’ and the ‘Dark Knight’ Lie"},"content":{"rendered":"

\"logoAaron Eckhart on ‘Wander’ and the ‘Dark Knight’ Lie. The actor looks at the highs and lows of indie filmmaking and reflects on Harvey Dent, 12 years later: “He would\u2019ve told the truth.”<\/p>\n

Aaron Eckhart is living on the edge these days, and he couldn\u2019t be more excited about it. With April Mullen\u2019s Wander set for release Dec. 4, Eckhart is at the beginning of a \u201cthree or four\u201d film run of independent releases that offer him freedom he\u2019s rarely found in the major studio system. On the set of Wander, Eckhart embraced the daily unpredictability of independent film, especially since it suited his character rather well. In the desert-set thriller, Eckhart plays Arthur Bretnik, an unhinged private investigator who\u2019s trying to expose the conspiracy behind his daughter\u2019s death.<\/p>\n

\u201cIndependent moviemaking is certainly more like the wild, Wild West. You\u2019re on the edge all the time. You don\u2019t know if you\u2019re going to make your days. You don\u2019t know if you\u2019re going to have enough money for the next day. There\u2019s also a lot of freedom in that,\u201d Eckhart tells The Hollywood Reporter. \u201cI can\u2019t even think about all the times in [Wander] where we didn\u2019t have what we needed \u2014 or it didn\u2019t seem like it \u2014 and we had to improvise. But it\u2019s exciting to me because I can change the words if I want. I can improvise. I can make stuff up. When I\u2019m on a big-budget movie, I\u2019m not doing that. It\u2019s more corporate.\u201d<\/p>\n

Eckhart, who\u2019s most known for his unforgettable turn as Harvey Dent\/Two-Face in Christopher Nolan\u2019s crime epic The Dark Knight, is also weighing in on the lie created by Batman (Christian Bale) and Gotham City police commissioner Jim Gordon (Gary Oldman) at the end of the film. The lie, which was a counter response to the Joker’s (Heath Ledger) corruption of Dent, pinned Two-Face\u2019s murders on Batman in order to protect Dent\u2019s reputation as Gotham\u2019s \u201cwhite knight.\u201d Despite Batman and Gordon\u2019s good intentions, Eckhart believes that Harvey would have disagreed with their decision.<\/p>\n

\u201cHe would\u2019ve told the truth. That\u2019s the great thing about Harvey Dent. Despite whatever is going on, he\u2019s a truth-teller and he\u2019s a moral center,\u201d Eckhart explains. \u201cHarvey Dent was out there fighting for every man and woman, for truth and justice, and he put himself on the line. But having done so, he got bit, and he was forever changed. But you don\u2019t want to lose your Harvey Dents in life. No matter how much money or pressure there is, no matter how much coercion, control or corruption there is, Harvey Dent is going to stay true to the moral center and the truth. People can rely on that, and you don\u2019t see that today.\u201d<\/p>\n

In a recent conversation with THR, Eckhart also discusses his relationship to the major studio system, why Nolan\u2019s sets are indie-like and his first reaction to the Dark Knight script.<\/p>\n

So who or what piqued your interest in Wander?<\/h1>\n

Well, it\u2019s always really about story and character, and when you\u2019re reading a script, if your five senses get involved while you\u2019re reading it, it\u2019s a good sign. So I just thought, \u201cHey, it would be a great acting challenge to go play this character and it would be fun to play this character.\u201d It\u2019s some guy who\u2019s half out of his mind, and he\u2019s thought to be paranoid and crazy. He\u2019s also grieving the death of his child, and he\u2019s removed himself from society, in a tin can out in the desert. Everybody thinks he\u2019s nuts, so I like the story of the little guy going up against the insurmountable big guy and winning in a sense. There are three things in life that are tough to take, which are coercion, control and corruption. I call them the Three Cs, and that\u2019s what this movie deals with. You have a man who wants to be free and live his life, and yet, he has to live with the pain of his daughter\u2019s death because somebody was doing something nefarious and he caught wind of it. Then he got punished for it, and we see a lot of that today. We see a lot of that in the world. It\u2019s the idea that the big wigs make experiments on us and use us as their pawns. To them, death is nothing. It\u2019s all about power and greed, and here you have a guy who\u2019s basically nothing. He\u2019s dust. He\u2019s down and out. He\u2019s nothing to nobody. He has nobody, and yet, he stands up to the forces of evil. I like that story.<\/p>\n

I loved the visual of you and Tommy Lee Jones \u2014 the two actors who are most commonly associated with Harvey Dent\/Two-Face \u2014 hosting a podcast in the middle of the desert. I was hooked right then and there.<\/h1>\n

(Laughs.) Yeah.<\/p>\n

Would you and Tommy work quickly together, or would you push for a couple more takes just for curiosity\u2019s sake?<\/h1>\n

Oh man, I always want more takes. You can\u2019t give me enough takes, but that being said, we were pretty good with that. It was such a magical moment. I mean, listen, you\u2019re out in the middle of nowhere, the desert in New Mexico, and you\u2019re sitting next to an Airstream. I forgot all the crew and that sort of stuff. I got them out of my mind. And then, to just play that wonderfully written scene, it was awesome. I loved it. I loved just going off like that, and then improvising too. There was a lot of improvisation in the sense of what\u2019s on my mind? What\u2019s on Tommy\u2019s mind? What do we think about? It was that sort of stuff, and whatever they take, they take. But Tommy was right there and he jumped in. From the day Tommy got there, he got it. Obviously, he\u2019s a pro. He\u2019s a great actor, an Academy Award winner, and it was a joy to work with Tommy and to say these words.<\/p>\n

What makes someone like Arthur so conspiracy-minded at the start of the movie? Is it a distraction from grief?<\/h1>\n

Obviously, he\u2019s consumed by grief over his daughter and wife. However, throughout history, you have patterns of people who have power and control, and their minds get up to imagining things and doing devious things. They also have the wherewithal to do those things. So people get up to some devious things that are perpetrated on the public at large, but in the movie, Arthur didn\u2019t look at it as conspiracy. When somebody says something is conspiracy theory, it\u2019s a way of shutting down the conversation, and that\u2019s what he was fighting against. If something is a conspiracy, if it\u2019s true, then it will bear the weight of scrutiny. And [finding the truth] was what Arthur was doing \u2026 If you start putting the dots together like Arthur and you go, \u201cIf you label this a conspiracy theory, I don\u2019t give a crap. It\u2019s the truth. Just because you don\u2019t want me to talk about the truth, you\u2019ll do everything you can to stop me, and you\u2019ll label me as this, that and the other.\u201d If you look at the news today, you\u2019ll find incidences where this is happening all the time, but people get scared. If you challenge people in a way, you\u2019re going to take away their power and their money, and they can\u2019t let that happen \u2026 Everything can\u2019t be a conspiracy theory. Now, some things can, but everything can\u2019t.<\/p>\n

Since independent film doesn\u2019t have the resources of the major studio system, do you root for a film like Wander just a little bit more?<\/h1>\n

Well, not more or less, but I root for it, though. I\u2019ll tell you that. I enjoy making [independent film], and I\u2019m in Wander, so I root for it. I also love the people who made it and who invited me to be in it. But I don\u2019t really have a relationship with studio film anymore. I guess the last studio film I was in was Sully. Is that right?<\/p>\n

Does Midway count?<\/h1>\n

Well no, actually. Midway was a Chinese-financed movie outside of the studio. It was obviously a huge budget, which makes it more like a studio film. But listen, I\u2019ve always said that the movie business is the wild, Wild West because you\u2019re there, you\u2019re by yourself and you\u2019re making this thing, this baby. And it\u2019s one of the last bastions where if somebody screws up, you don\u2019t see them the next day. That\u2019s it, because you can\u2019t afford it. There\u2019s too much money on the line, and you don\u2019t have enough time. And so it\u2019s like the wild, Wild West. Independent moviemaking is certainly more like the wild, Wild West. You\u2019re out there. You\u2019re on the edge all the time. You don\u2019t know if you\u2019re going to make your days. You don\u2019t know if you\u2019re going to have enough money for the next day. You have a small crew. There\u2019s also a lot of freedom in that. And especially with Wander, being in the middle of the desert in New Mexico, trains would go by and I\u2019d just say, \u201cLet\u2019s go follow the train!\u201d So we\u2019d go bark at the train, and film it. (Laughs.) I love that. I don\u2019t know if it\u2019s in the movie, but I love it. It\u2019s great for the character and it\u2019s great for the crew. So I love independent film. Now, again, you\u2019re always on the edge. I mean, I can\u2019t even think about all the times in this movie where we didn\u2019t have what we needed \u2014 or it didn\u2019t seem like it \u2014 and we had to improvise. You just have to pull it together, always. I can remember movies that I did where I had producers tell me, \u201cEvery single day, we didn\u2019t know if we were going to be able to film the next day.\u201d It\u2019s scary, especially if you\u2019re a producer. And yet, I have three or four independent films that I\u2019m going to go do that are even less of a budget than this one. But it\u2019s exciting to me because I can change the words if I want. I can improvise. I can make stuff up. When I\u2019m on a big-budget movie, I\u2019m not doing that. It\u2019s more corporate. However, that being said, I\u2019ve always had very great experiences on studio movies. The Dark Knight comes to mind and if I were to talk about The Dark Knight, I would say it was just a big-budget independent movie.<\/p>\n

Every time I talk to an actor who\u2019s worked with Christopher Nolan, they make that same point about his sets and how they feel surprisingly intimate, or indie-like, despite the $100 million to $200 million price tag.<\/h1>\n

That\u2019s the way Chris handles his movies. Nobody really goes back to their trailers too much. It\u2019s not an extravagant set in terms of what\u2019s off-set. Everybody is expected to be on-set all the time and involved in the movie. The crew is exactly the same way, and that\u2019s what I really liked about The Dark Knight. Chris is firmly in control of everything that goes on in that movie. Now that I think about it, the difference between independent and studio film is when you have an auteur. When you have somebody who is in control of the mechanism of the movie, that\u2019s an independent movie to me. When you have producers and the studio coming in and dictating what scenes to do, how they\u2019re played and what words to say, that, to me, is a studio movie. That is corporate and that\u2019s not as fun. I like to call the director a dictator. They\u2019re either a benevolent or a malevolent dictator, but it has to be that way. When you can go to the director and say, \u201cHey, I\u2019m going to do this, I\u2019m going to do that,\u201d and they go, \u201cYeah, fine, do it,\u201d and nobody argues with you or questions you, then that\u2019s a good day.<\/p>\n

At the end of The Dark Knight, Jim Gordon (Gary Oldman) and Batman (Christian Bale) decided to lie for the sake of Harvey Dent and what he meant to Gotham City. Thus, Batman took the blame for Two-Face\u2019s murders, and that lie created peace for the next eight years. But just for the sake of speculation, do you think Harvey, prior to Two-Face, would have approved of their plan to create a lie on his behalf? Or would he have wanted them to tell the truth?<\/h1>\n

No, he would\u2019ve told the truth. That\u2019s the great thing about Harvey Dent. Despite whatever is going on, he\u2019s a truth-teller and he\u2019s a moral center. And not only that, he\u2019s the face of truth, right? I don\u2019t want to say he\u2019s not hiding behind something, but he\u2019s not. Now, when he becomes Two-Face, he is. But Harvey Dent was out there fighting for every man and woman, for truth and justice, and he put himself on the line. But having done so, he got bit, and he was forever changed. But you don\u2019t want to lose your Harvey Dents in life. No matter how much money or pressure there is, no matter how much coercion, control or corruption there is, Harvey Dent is going to stay true to the moral center and the truth. People can rely on that, and you don\u2019t see that today. Again, I don\u2019t want to say hiding behind a mask, but superheroes are behind masks and capes, et cetera. Well, what about the superheroes that aren\u2019t hiding behind a mask? What about the superheroes that stay true to themselves and to the greater good \u2014 without any superpowers? Where are they? And that\u2019s what\u2019s exciting about Harvey Dent, especially in a town like Gotham where everybody\u2019s corrupt. It\u2019s so dark. See, that\u2019s another thing too. When you become a politician, you\u2019re expected to become corrupted, and it\u2019s only those people who do not become corrupted that stand out. Otherwise, life is a lie. Here we are, worshipping politicians, sports stars, celebrities and all this sort of stuff, and yet, we don\u2019t know if they\u2019re corrupted or not. We don\u2019t know why they\u2019re making their decisions or what\u2019s going on behind the scenes. So when you find out that somebody\u2019s been true to themselves and true to truth, that\u2019s a rare bird. So I believe Harvey would not approve of Two-Face or the lie that was told.<\/p>\n

Everybody expected The Dark Knight to be Batman versus Joker, and while it does have that component, the story is really all about Harvey. Were you pretty blown away when you first realized that the film revolves around Harvey?<\/h1>\n

Oh my gosh. Let me tell you. I had a meeting with Chris and he said, \u201cI\u2019ll have the script delivered to your house.\u201d Well, this guy comes and delivers the script, and he\u2019s sitting outside in my driveway while I read this novel. (Laughs.) Was I surprised? I thought I would be on page 26 for half the page. I thought, \u201cYou can\u2019t have room for that many main players, right?\u201d You\u2019re talking about Gordon, Joker [Heath Ledger], Batman, Rachel [Maggie Gyllenhaal]. You have all of these characters, and yet, they all have equal play. And not only that, the writing is out of this world, right? I could not believe that Harvey Dent was actually in this movie and that I was going to play him. So I thank Chris for that. Some scripts are whatever; you get through them and hey, fine. But The Dark Knight was a novel and it was thick. It was like reading literature. And there\u2019s something about Gotham City too. You have a city that\u2019s oppressed and being run by a criminal gang. People can\u2019t go out during the day, everybody\u2019s scared for their safety, and the people that are paid to protect them are corrupted. They\u2019re part of the gang and nobody can trust anybody. Sound like anything that\u2019s familiar? And then people are looking to a superhero for their liberty and their freedom. Not only is it a great story and a great movie, but this is what cinema and art are all about. It\u2019s a reflection of our times. Chris knocked it out of the park and that\u2019s why that movie is so important. And then, obviously, the performance of Heath. What a special, special movie. I was happy to be a part of it.<\/p>\n

Wander is available in select theaters, on-demand and digital Dec. 4. This interview has been edited for length and clarity.<\/p>\n

View this article at The Hollywood Reporter<\/a>.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

Aaron Eckhart on ‘Wander’ and the ‘Dark Knight’ Lie. The actor looks at the highs and lows of indie filmmaking and reflects on Harvey Dent, 12 years later: “He would\u2019ve told the truth.” Aaron Eckhart is living on the edge these days, and he couldn\u2019t be more excited about it. With April Mullen\u2019s Wander set
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